Me go for books first...

If me go for apps first then I would attend an SCAWI Conference.


AE

SCAWI!

ha!!

Most people who create apps, even wildly successful ones, make very little money on it. In your case, you'd have to split it with whatever team directs/designs the code. And I can't see doing "readings" in libraries, etc., where the author is holding up a smartphone or even an iPad and saying, "and then the Princess..."

IMO, go for paper book first, app second.

I agree with the other posts. While we see more and more PB's being offered as apps by their publishers, it's for the most part books that have already proven their popularity and success in paper format.
Teachers and Librarians still need the larger Picture book format to read to groups, show the illustration. Two year olds know how to work the iPad, how to view books on them but they are still a pricey machine and breakable. I doubt many parents are yet willing to allow the toddler to take the iPad to bed with them:)
I'm sure we will see FisherPrice come out with a plastic version that can be dropped down the stairs without damage and is waterproof (kool-aid proof) but till then, books in the hands of little ones will be the norm. I would thus concentrate on submitting the dummy to Commercial publishers for print but who, at a later date, may make it into an app if it becomes a hit.

I know that our local library wont be buying any of the stupid 26 checkout e-books.

Good grief-- There have been popular books where each copy circulated about 90 times IN THE FIRST THREE MONTHS. So unless the book isn't popular, 26 checkouts won't cut it. And paying as much as a 'real' book for something that has a much more limited life expectancy is... well.... pointless.

HC has made a lot of librarians VERy,VERY angry.... I don't think that's generally a smart thing to do.

(Also, will they then limit their REGULAR e-books to 26 reads?)

Oh, my husband said HC based it on how many times the average HC book circulates before it 'wears out.'

But most books last much longer than 26--- so is HC basically saying "Our print books lower quality than the industry standard!"?????

Also, I was thinking about the commonwealth model, and I think for most authors it would be a net loss.

Why? Because most libraries have a few books that circulate ALOT, and many books that circulate very little.

So the vast majority of published authors would be making very little off a plan like that.

BUT most authors are also heavy library USERS. And library programs help promote their books. And libraries are one of the ways that young readers discover new authors.

So, while the biggies (Rick Riordan, Stephanie Meyers, etc.) would make a killing off of a plan like the commonwealth has, most authors would probably be net losers, since if the libraries have to pay by the checkout, they'll make fewer purchases and provide fewer services.

And....instead of starting a discussion, I apparently killed the thread........

But one more factioid that came up in discussion at home--- the 26 checkouts is how many times the average paperback circulates. HOWEVER, Harper is charging hardcover prices for their 'only use as much as a PB' e-books.

So, the solution MIGHT be to charge PB prices instead---or have several tiers of e-books for libraries:
1. Unlimited use -24.95 (or whatever)
2. 26 use - 6.95
3. Single use - $1 (Which would be cheaper for many libraries than using ILL, so it might be a way to meet patron requests on books the library wouldn't normally carry.)

My heart goes out to you! I have done... well... most of those things.

I did that. And with each day that passed, I realized another thing I had done wrong. A week later, I mailed a new package to a different editor (duh) along with a nice cover letter for the office admin staff.

Form rejection.

But, I know I gave it my best!

Thank you for sharing it ! Very nice
Bilgibankası

Right, that makes a lot of sense. The one bit I'm not sure on. I haven't sold yet... do you think I should keep submitting?


*ducks and runs for cover*

Six months HAHAHAHAHAAAHAA

hahahaha

oh lordy.

Six WEEKS is being generous.

(Though as an agent, I'd say that six DAYS is being generous.)

The thing is though, whatever you consider generous, since you didn't set a timeline for exclusivity at the outset, you can't get mad at her for taking forever and a day. It is what it is.

But if she's this disrespectful of your time, she might be a black hole that will NEVER get back to you. At this point I personally would just back-burner it, pretend like it is a rejection, and start subbing to other people.

If she does decide to read it and love it, then awesome - and if she doesn't, well, at least you will have been doing footwork to get in somewhere else.

As EA said, we've seen variations of this question on posts before. What I find interesting and new is the part about keeping the requested revisions for that specific editor and submit the previous draft elsewhere. Thanks for the tip.

I am curious about not sending out the revised version to other editors. I understand that the original editor did some work on this, but presumably the author agreed with the suggestions and proceeded to make them his/herself. I would think the author would want to send out the best possible version; otherwise, you're burning through editors with a lesser version.

Maybe it would make sense to send out the newer version but let the first editor have first dibs should others express interest?

Word verification: bureads ... sorta like the author's ms right now.

Very helpful advice, but I'm mostly posting to give you props for the Flaming Lips reference. ;-)

In regard to your last point, sometimes walking away is definitely the right solution. I spent years revising and re-revising my first novel, shopping it and trying to find a buyer. Frustrated, I finally put it in a drawer, started a new novel, and wrote a few short stories - one of which has become my first published work.

There are plenty of short story markets, and though these days many of them can't afford to pay, the enormous ego boost that comes from publication is fuel to keep a writer going - and hopefully keep us from all becoming bitter old prunes who blame "the gatekeepers" for holding down our careers.

Oh, and in regard to your second: test readers and critique groups are INVALUABLE.

This is awesome advice. I'm having an issue right now where I am stuck 45,000 words in. My brain has literally stopped working. I'm fighting with either pushing through the muck or setting it aside for a few days...ugh! Why did I decide to write!? WHY?
Thank you so much for this post!

Gina - 45,000 is one of the hardest places to be in a story, at least for me. The Dreaded Middle can be killer, but the climax comes along eventually. Take a breather if you need one, but don't give up!

Yes, thank you for this post. I needed the kick in the pants (will probably need a few more if you want to come over) to help me find my next novel.

An overworked story is as bad (if not worse) than one that has not been titivated enough.

I don't agree with Melinda at all...I don't think I've ever read a book and thought, "Hey, this is overworked."

I don't even know what that would look like.

I can think of a number of times when I've "finished" a manuscript, submitted it, then thought of a way to make it ten times better on my way back home from the mailbox. TIME is my number one.

Not submitting is the other trap, but I'm working on that one. Setting daily research goals (which houses will want this?), and weekly submission goals, for a completed manuscript helps a lot with that.

Hi Alice - i didn't mean overworked books, I meant overworked manuscripts (which don't tend to become books). Sometimes I have worked so hard on a story that it has become a hot mess. No amount of polishing will make that story a diamond. My best results have usually been from stories that I worked on quickly and fussed over the least. I've submitted underworked and overworked stories and learnt from experience what to aim for. If you are always waiting for a manuscript to be perfect you might never submit anything.

@Melinda

I agree that sometimes you just have to archive a manuscript and move on.

To my mind, this scenario happens when:
a) It's been rejected by like, everyone. It even gets sent back by the postman. Despite infinity edits.
b) There are some definite hints on the horizon that it's a load of ahem, AND I'm also bored silly by it.

But when you said, "Sometimes I have worked so hard on a story that it has become a hot mess," that's what got me shaking my head and thinking, "How?" because I love editing and in the long run editing always improves a manuscript.

Let's say you make an edit and it just doesn't work. It might even add major suck to your manuscript. No worries, just change it back! No big deal. You DO have all your previous drafts, right?

I think what's bothering me is that, IMO, there are only three things an ms can be:

1) good enough (or better if you're lucky)
2) underworked
3) not workable

If something's overworked, all you have to do is revert to previous edits, no?

R.e. when to submit: I don't know. IMO, the easiest part of editing an ms is making sure there aren't any genuine errors i.e. things that are objectively wrong with the manuscript (like typos, contextual spelling, grammar and syntax, simple logical errors). So I guess I'd say the right time to submit is definitely after those things are fixed. At some point.

I can't comment on when an ms is ready where plot, characters, etc. is concerned. It's too specific a subject to give a general opinion.

But, but, but: nobody who matters would ever know the difference.

(Just trying on my American chauvinism to see if it still fits me.)

That's a very interesting situation. I think that's great that the book is getting published in the country the story is set in, though.

- Nicholas

I have no advice to share, sorry. But I find it interesting that the story is set in Sweden, because I'm Swedish. /Jess

I don't know what other language/country the questioner meant. I chose a language at random for the post title. Sorry to disappoint.

If you want to sell subsidiary rights (audio, film, foreign/translation), you probably need an agent.

If you don't understand the nuances of options, multi-book deals, and non-compete clauses, you need an agent.

If only getting one was as easy as knowing you need one.

I am with anonymous atop this commentary.

I don't require any of the things EA suggests... but I DO Love you so much EA!! Yessireeeeeeeeee)

The problem is 'do I have any of the qualifications that said agent would "see... predict... know what to do with and want to sell..."'.

Also, Trevor is correct... it is what the agent sees in you ... for them.... two way street that part... but

I WORK in business... and I "get it"

If you're a pb author who writes four or five mss. a year, you shouldn't have an agent. An agent will think you're too prolific and won't want to represent all of them.

Trevor-- if only getting one was as easy as getting published.

In my experience. And that of other authors I know. YMMV.

well, this was an useful and interesting post (not that I need an agent).

"booby-trapped and pathless jungles" ...sounds like the ranch where INTERN is living now.

you also need an agent so you can post "THIS IS ME AND MY AWESOME AGENT DRINKING COSMOS!!!" photos on your website!

I have to agree with "Trevor". Getting an agent is difficult. Getting the right agent is very difficult.
It is obviously not impossible because people do manage it but it is still a veritable minefield!

Weelll yeah I might need one but until the right one comes along I'm not going to fret. My first novel is doing well making me a nice amount of pocket money and I hope to save enough to get bk two professionally published. Not really sure how much an agent could help me at the moment actually..

The Arrival, Book 1 of the BirthRight Trilogy available now

We miss THE INTERN.

Agreed, miss THE INTERN.

I don't think I have hissy fits or much of the above list - but I am still SO very thankful I have an agent. Not as a filter, but much needed advisor and confidence booster. Agents rock.

I have an agent, and that's good. But don't just jump at the first one who likes your work without checking the agent out very carefully. Some are great, other not so much. Or an agent might be above board but not have much experience in repping your genre. Develop a question list for them as to how they work.

A good agent can be a great business advisor. And for all of you in the search- hang in there. I was a slush pile find by my agent (six years ago now). It does happen.

If you want to hear back from editors up to a year faster...you need an agent. If it helps you be a better writer when people believe in you (not just your husband and mother, but people in the business,) you need an agent.

Anon. 7:06, I see what you're saying, but I think agents can help you develop relationships with multiple editors, at which point you can hopefully sell more than one pb manuscript a year. Do you see this maybe happening down the road?

I would rather spend time writing the best novel I can, than swotting up on what an agent does and trying to that job too.

Much better that I stick to writing and leave the agent to do the agenting.

I need an agent. Not because I want love in support, but because
1. I hate pitching manuscripts
2. I hate keeping track of submissions
3. I hate haggling
4. I always sound dumb on the phone
5. I want to use my free time to WRITE, dangit.

Which is why I'm currently preparing to write queries again. Because I want an agent so that I will never have to write queries again!

I wrote about this a few months ago too - http://literaticat.blogspot.com/2010/11/do-you-even-need-agent.html

I am not calling you a COPYCAT, btw. ;)

I'm so with Deirdre! I want to use my time to write the best books I can. I don't want to spend it learning about foreign rights, contract negotiation, and the like.

On the other hand, I've heard from many in the industry that if you write PBs (which I do, as well as chapter books and YA), many agents will want to see you published before they will want to work with you. What say you, EA?

Ed Anon must be verklempt. Talk amongst yourselves.

I have been enjoying the phenomenon of Podiobooks.com, and I have been wondering where that lies on the spectrum of self-publishing. I know several of the more successful authors have had their books subsequently published, so it doesn't seem to mess with the rights, etc. Is that correct? I wouldn't think to try it as a path towards publishing, but it is an intriguing format, and I think it might be fun to try to tell a story that way. If I did, would it cause trouble with my credibility or my chances to get that story published later?

Here's my off-topic question: What's your experience with tattoos in the publishing industry? I'll soon be graduating college and I plan on working my way into publishing, but I also want to get a tattoo (on my arm, so it might accidentally be visible at times). I know it depends on the office usually, but I was wondering what your company's policy is, and if that is typical of the industry.

Hi EA! How are picture books that are "fractured fairy tales" doing these days? I know folktales aren't being looked at but I sometimes still see books like PONYELLA by Laura Numeroff (Jan. 2011) being published. I recently wrote one I think has potential about pirates but wonder if any editors or agents will be interested.

Oh joy-- I came here wanting to ask the Anonymous One a question and she is open to them! (Or other people are.)

I'm looking for an agent. So I'm reading listings. I see a whole lot of agents who graduated from college nine months ago, and list themselves as "editorial agents". Can anyone tell me what's up with that? What qualifies a young person with no editorial experience to edit manuscripts?

I know what an editorial agent is-- am just wondering why these agents think they should be them.

Elizabeth, if I were you I'd just get the tattoo in such a location that it could be revealed to others only on a need-to-know basis.

@Elizabeth Coon

My editor has a tattoo on her wrist. She's a senior editor at a Big Six publisher. I don't think it's an issue.

Good luck!!

I'm a freelance illustrator represented by a big agency(in terms that they represent a large number of illustrators). It turns out they're too large and too busy to devote any time to individual promotion, but this falls short of what I expected when I signed up with them two years ago. I was hoping for more
personal direction. The work they find for me is not very inspiring if I
may say so, and it usually takes them more than 3 months to pay for any
work I do for them (counting from the date I invoice). Is this normal?

Recently I've written and illustrated a picture book (I had the industry
standards in mind when I planned it: 32 pages, colored ends, a dummy with
sketches etc). I would really like to send a query to a few publishers,
but I know it's not really proper etiquette when one has an agent. I am
also thinking I should offer the project to my agent first, but I'm afraid they won't try too hard to sell it. If I go down that road, how much time does it usually take to get feedback when sending a picture book query through an agent? Or should I just break my contract with them and start querying on my own?

Thank you!

Anonymous at 3:45, you raise a good point-- it sucks to be bound to an agent who won't submit your work. Chances are the wording on your contract forbids you to submit it on your own. I found myself in that bind once.

My advice would be to get out of the contract by whatever means are legally available to you. (Read through the contract to see what's required.) But don't query your material till you've done so.

Thanks everyone! I know it seems like a silly question, but I couldn't stop worrying about it. :P

Hi EA -

Do you have any preference with working agented or unagented authors / illustrators, or does it all depend on the actual personalities involved?

Thanks for having 'open thread'!

Hey it was nice reading your posts!

Thanks for the open thread.

I have a dilemma regarding ebook publishing. I am a seasoned graphic designer/illustrator trying to break into the kidlit industry with an author/illustrator picture book.

I'd just begun sending out dummies of my book to potential agents when I was contacted by a publishing company specializing exclusively in ebook apps for the iPad. They had seen my work at a regional SCBWI event and wanted me to submit any manuscripts/dummies I happened to have for their review and possible acceptance. They went on, in that initial conversation, to say that if the app sold large numbers, it would make it potentially appealing to traditional publishers.

I'm a total noob at this (a key reason I was seeking an agent!) and don't want to miss the chance of my book being something really wonderful. Although I'm not afraid to embrace new technologies, I believe traditional publishing is better for many reasons. I know a good editor is worth her weight in gold and can do to a good MS what a good Art Director can do with a bunch of disparate pieces of art and copy.

Here's the question. If I submit to this app publisher, and they accept and publish my PB, will that completely shoot down any chances of it getting published as a traditional, printed book? Should I just stick it out and see what turns up with my submissions to agents?

elthoy, in any self publishing (or any situation at all) in which you don't sell/sign away the rights, then the rights are still yours, the author's.
I don't know anything about podio myself, and the real question is what legal arrangement is involved, and how quickly you could take your work off of podio if you were able to sell the rights elsewhere.

Elizabeth, like other commentors, I think the attitude to the odd tattoo in the workplace has gotten very understanding.
A significant amount of ink, or tattoos in very obvious places (covering your forearms, or on your face/neck, eg) may still put some people off.

Cara D,
Just like other picture books these days, you need a HOOK. 'Fractured fairytale' is not a hook. Ponies is a hook.

Pirates? Maybe. Many people in publishing (and in bookselling) are pretty tired of pirates, but if it could be published at the same time as Pirates of the Caribbean 5 or 6, you might find someone interested.

Anon,
re: editorial agents
I'd be a little hesitant to sign up with someone that new, too. But a lot of both agenting and editing is self-taught... so I would want such an agent (if he/she were interested in my novel) to send me his/her edits (or a meaningful editorial letter) BEFORE I signed up, so that I could see whether we were on the same page, and so that I had a written record of his/her feedback just in case later that feedback changed unexpectedly.

The upside is that any editorial agent is going to work with you BEFORE submitting, so if in the editorial process everything falls apart, it's unlikely to hurt you or your manuscript. Get back on the horse and find another agent.

re: illustration agencies:
I don't know what's normal, sorry.

re: how much time does it take
There IS no "normal", sorry.

My impression is that some illustration agencies really only offer a big group website, and not particular help with submitting projects. You may want to break your contract, and find a children's book agent.

I've heard from agents that the MG market right now is soft. Is it because library sales are down? And arre editors are buying fewer books, or are agents less interested because the advances are so much lower than YA these days?

Kellion, the population bulge in YA is gradually ending, and so I would expect the publishing bulge in YA to normalize soon, too.
"Soft" is such a relative term. A while back people spoke of the plush market as going soft, and in that situation they meant OH HELL NO. NO MORE PLUSH.
But when agents talk about MG or picture books being soft right now, all they mean is that there are rarely any feeding frenzies over them. Are publishers still buying those categories? Yes, of course.

One prevailing sentiment among writing forums is to hold off submitting until your book represents the best that it can be.

But what does that mean when there is no objective standard by which to measure your book?

EA, thanks for answering my question about editorial agents.

Can I ask another question, please? And this time I'll give myself a name to reduce the number of anonymati:

Say I'm querying agents and already have serious interest in the manuscript from a big 6 publisher. (The only publisher who's seen the ms.) Do I mention the editor's name, or is that, like, namedropping and so uncool?

Thanks again!

Anon at 12:31:
That may be the prevailing sentiment because so many of us have learned the hard way about thinking a MS is done, sending it off and then realizing, "Oh no! It needs more work."

For me, I now (after having an agent point out a plot hole that should have obvious to me) go through at least two rounds of beta readers before I hit send. Yes, there may be no objective standard, but I find it essential to show my work to as many critique partners as possible. I don't want the agent to be the one who finds mistakes I overlooked.

I hope that's helpful. I think a MS is done when all your critique partners start giving you only nit-picky feedback. Best wishes to you!

I have attended several SCBWI conferences where attendees can submit to those editors who spoke/workshopped. My question is: do those editors actually read the conference submissions or are they pretty much read by interns/editorial assistants that would be reading anyway if I submitted to slush.

EA, have you noticed any difference in the way you read submissions now that there are e-readers? My agent sent me a rejection recently which made it obvious that the editor hadn't looked past the first chapter or two. Of course I don't expect a thorough read from somebody who isn't interested, but I wondered if in the days of paper manuscripts, she might have leafed through just to see where the book was heading. Do e-readers lead to more linear reading of manuscripts, do you think?

Dancing Duck,
No, it's cool. I mean, don't just say you "have interest"--any agent will want to know just what that means.
If it means you have an offer, then bear in mind that you are running the risk of signing on with an agent who only wants to do the deal and isn't that into your writing.

"I have attended several SCBWI conferences where attendees can submit to those editors who spoke/workshopped. My question is: do those editors actually read the conference submissions or are they pretty much read by interns/editorial assistants that would be reading anyway if I submitted to slush."

Impossible to tell. I know editors who have an assistant (someone they trust) read things; I know editors who read such submissions themselves.

NW,
I suppose it's possible, but in my experience, no.
Every editor I know reads just up to the point when she is sure she isn't interested, and that's it. We may go to the synopsis to see if it looks like it gets more interesting later.

I hope you aren't like one of our recent submitters, who sent as sample chapters 45, 46, and 47. If your manuscript only really gets GOOD halfway through the book, there's a much bigger problem than ereaders here.

Thanks. No, it wasn't a question of where it got good, it was a question of knowing what kind of book it was. (The synopsis and TOC also should have made that clear, but . . . whatever.)

What do you do when friends of friends/complete strangers want to "sit down and talk about writing." Normally, I like to be helpful, but I don't have time for this right now. Is there a way to be helpful and polite without actually doing the "sitting down"? I can't honestly suggest that people read Writer's Market (didn't find it helpful.) Explaining what is helpful would take forever! Maybe I'll suggest this blog and they'll read my comment--problem solved!

to 11:07 -

I have a short list of books/websites that I will pass on to people. Interestingly, I have yet to get any follow up questions after I do this, I think because most people aren't as serious about doing the work as they'd like to believe and they don't want to admit they didn't look at the material.

Or you could try what a friend of mine does: she says she will give someone 20 minutes on the phone - and after that she starts charging.

Or someone else I know simply states an hourly consulting rate upfront. She started this as a ploy to simply repel people, but actually got a few takers.

Thanks 11:55. I like your idea of the books and Web sites--and I'm not surprised at the response you've gotten. I once spent a long time at a party telling a guy (who asked) about the many resources available to aspiring children's book writers (such as children's books themselves!) Once he learned how he could pursue his goal, he dropped it. I don't get it.

Thanks, EA. I mentioned it in about seven query letters and got one instant form rejection (no responses otherwise), which made me wonder if maybe I'd done something really rude.

anon 12:21 - "Once he learned how he could pursue his goal, he dropped it. I don't get it."

This has happened to me so many times. I think most people who claim to want "advice" want one of two things:

- either they want some kind of magical free ride [personal contacts handed out or for me to take their work and submit it - ie, get it published - for them]

- or they just want their ongoing pipe dream of how one day they will be an author enabled and fostered. I once was informed by a woman [who had eagerly asked me how to get into books] that she was going to wait until after her kids grew up. Her youngest was a one year old.


Side rant: It is amazing to me how many advice-seeking "illustrators" I meet who not only have no portfolios, have no interest in putting one together! Or "writers" who dead seriously ask me if they really need to write out the whole book or if "just the idea is enough". Or people who say that children's books are their ultimate dream job - yet know nothing about either current or past books, authors or illustrators. I am dumbfounded by people who claim to want to be in a profession that clearly BORES them!

And a profession that they belittle even as they aspire to it.

I think a lot of people think writing and illustrating is like being on vacation-- very little effort. Which is the appeal.

I have noticed a large amount of agents saying they aren't interested in sci-fi and/or fantasy, however this seems to be a "trend" that isn't going away any time soon and I don't fully understand the aversion to it. I mean, sure dystopian might not always be popular, but since Harry Potter I haven't seen this genre disappearing either. Have you noticed this with editors as well (the dislike of these genres) or is it something that is happening only on an agent level? I get that not everyone likes sci-fi and fantasy, but clearly the kids like it, so what's the deal?

Yes! I came here needing some advice, lucky me.

I had the opportunity to send a manuscript to an editor who usually doesn't accept unsolicited ms because I attended a SCBWI conference and I had a little sticker thingy I could put on my submission that supposedly got it through to the editor. My question is - it's been 4.5 months and I haven't heard anything back. I have no way to contact him because any future correspondence wouldn't have that magical little sticker on it to avoid the trash bin. So what do I do? Is there any way to get through to a big publishing house and find out the status of a manuscript. Or should I wait 6 months before I do any sort of inquiry? And if I haven't heard anything by 6 months, is there anything I can do then?

I see the dislike of fantasy and scifi among about as many editors and agents as I see it in readers.
This isn't a professional thing, it's a personal thing. No matter what genre is currently hot, you don't want an agent or editor who just doesn't personally enjoy it.

E.lee,
You could try to find out his email and send him a polite reminder, but there isn't a great deal else you can do. Except, of course, continuing to submit elsewhere!

Anon 12:21 and Editorial Anonymous. I think I know deep down that this is often what's going on and why it bothers me so much. I work really hard at this, with often heartbreaking results (even being a published author with an awesome agent.) For someone to think it's easy is frustrating.

On a positive note, I love writing children's books. My family understands and supports the sacrifices and I'm very grateful for that.

If an agent or editor gives you positive feedback and critiques to your partial, but doesn't ask to see more, is it okay to send an email thanking them?

I honestly appreciate the feedback. Also, they made an assumption about the direction of the story that was way waaay off, and I wanted to let them know... who knows, maybe it would change their mind about asking for more.

The thing is, I don't want to become a pest, and I know agents/editors aren't interested in email correspondence with me.

What's proper etiquette here? Do I thank them and politely mention the story isn't what they thought it was? Or do I just do nothing?

(The reason their assumption about the story was off is because I was able to submit without a query. Lucky me, but they assumed from the first pages that the story was going in a certain direction, and didn't have the query to get the whole picture...)

Help please :)

Politely Perplexed, you're asking two different questions.

Thank them for the useful feedback, absolutely. If that's your only motive for getting in touch.

Tell them the story isn't going where they think it's going-- I wouldn't bother. If they'd been intrigued enough by it they'd have asked to see more so they could find out. Maybe in your revision, you can make it clearer where the story's going, for the next person you submit it to.

Pointedly,
Yes, it's fine to thank the editor. You could perhaps point out that the manuscript was going a different direction in an oblique way-- as in, thank the editor for making you realize that the manuscript's beginning was setting up a false expectation, and and let him/her know that you'll be tweaking the beginning to better represent the direction of the book.

I've found that people don't actually want to know about the REALITY of writing. It's too much of a 'downer.'

As in "Well, my WIP is now in the revising stage, and after that I'll send it out, and hey! This one is really good! So maybe in the next 5 years or so, I'll have a book out!"

Also, people get really upset that even PB writers (which I am not) work on their books for months or years at a time. That just because it's 500 words doesn't mean that you can spend 20 minutes and then poof! Fame and wealth!

(It's always worse around this time of year b/c of the Dr. Seuss celebrations. I mean, how hard can it BE to write like Seuss? All he did was make up a bunch of rhyming nonsense! Look! I can do it too!

The caliphanator of gingamazoo
Has a sploogarupone and six gimmyguys too
And he never would donate them all to my zoo
So I'll just have to go out and steal them.......

See! Look! I can make up words and rhyme! My gosh! I'm a genius! Give me money!

)

Uh, yeah. So I've found that when someone asks about writing for kids, and you actually give a reply based on REALITY, it makes you...unpopular.

Deirdre Mundy said...

"So I've found that when someone asks about writing for kids, and you actually give a reply based on REALITY, it makes you...unpopular."

Thats the beauty part! I used to actually encourage people, which made me wildly popular amongst the deluded. Then I changed my ways and instead would start immediately talking about RESEARCHING publishers/books/market, and laugh inside as I watched their eyes glaze over. Most couldn't get away from me fast enough.

That was the test. Only about one out of twenty people will get excited about being told plain facts about publishing, and those are the only people that I think would have enough gas in them to actually pursue this business.

Thanks guys :)

I'd love to hear an editor's point of view about the deep discount clause. My agent says it's normal for publishers to cut royalties in half AND switch from list to net on books sold at 50% of cover price or less (which would be all books sold through Amazon as well as special sales).

It seems to me that doing either one or the other would cover the loss of income to the publisher. Doing both seems like double dipping at the author's expense. But what does it look like from the publisher side? Is this practice justified?

Thanks!

mr/ds,
I wish I knew more about this issue, and I'm not sure who I can trust to give me a really straight answer. What I know is that some publishers switch to net and don't cut the royalty (but the royalty is a flat royalty, without escalations). And I know that when this practice started, there were fewer high-discount sales than there are now.

I am not certain that the clause is truly fair to authors in the current market, but how to make it fair is not necessarily a simple thing.

It's very likely that your agent knows more about what's common across houses than I do.

I think before the industry clears this issue up (which it might have, in perhaps the next decade), the digital book market will make these questions moot--and give us a whole other set of injustices to worry about.

Thanks! And . . . eep.

To be far, MR/DS, I am sure your agent didn't say she LIKED it, or that she accepted it without ARGUING... I am confident that she said that, as irritating a clause as this is, sadly, it is not unusual.

We are NOT going to be able to get publishers to not give special breaks to people who buy in bulk non-returnable (who we'd hope would be the only people who would be getting those prices).

I assume that it changes to net at this point because the retail price is moot -- these are NOT sales direct to consumers, nor are they sales to retail stores who get a 40-45% discount and then mark the book up to retail price, but can also return them.

Instead, they are probably to things like special book clubs, and purchasers like this are either not selling the books at all, or have subscription-based somethings, or have totally different rates anyway, and so are not selling the book the way a bookstore does at retail price, AND they can't return them. So net makes sense actually.

Why it is often CUT IN HALF is another story. I imagine it is the same reason paperback royalties are cut in half, theory being because you are selling so many more at the lower price, and the profit margin is thinner? I know. It is headache inducing.

What your agent endeavors to do is have the point at which'deep discount' kicks in set as high as possible, and try to specify that certain online retailers don't count under this clause.

Oh, you agents always stick up for each other.

No, seriously, I'm not sure what that sounded like, but I was in no way impugning my agent, who happens to be fantastic. What I meant was, "An expert (MY AGENT) tells me this is usual, so how do you, EA, explain this from the publisher's point of view?"

I just thought there might be some explanation, other than the one given in the recent SCBWI newsletter (which was basically, "because publishers are cheating authors").

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That sheep joke comment was baaaad!

And of course if you cross a sheep with a kangaroo you get a woolly jumper.
I am agent hunting and the general view is that it would be wiser to find an agent in the northern hemisphere and seek publication there. I have been told the odds on getting published are about the same but the end result is likely to be a much wider market.

Aren't the very successful Rangers Apprentice Series written by a guy in Australia?

"I also review the YA books which come out of the US and the UK and most of it, which, yeah, I know, sells, is actually formulaic which my students (I’m a high school teacher) turn their noses at – preferring to read ADULT literature."

I don't quite understand this comment. Do you mean, "My students, having read every single YA book published in New Zealand, all of which are stellar, are now disappointed in the uniformly low-quality YA books they see from the UK and US"? Or do you mean that they prefer adult literature to YA, regardless of where it comes from?

If the latter, they are exactly like high school students in the US. Generally, YA is read by kids in the 11-14 age range. Older teens move on to adult books, until they're old enough to go back to YA (and MG, and picture books) and appreciate those as well.

If the former, I would like to hear some titles of the "formulaic" YA books you've been reviewing.

It's a very different story with an overseas agent but as a New Zealand children's author with several titles published here it seems very few titles published in New Zealand ever get picked up overseas, yet many, many overseas titles are distributed in NZ. Getting picked up in Australia can be a springboard but it is rare and i would love to know (if the quality of my work is not the issue)what the barriers are?

I have to say, the fact that out of over a thousand books this child has read, she has only found one self-published book worth keeping is pretty much a perfect illustration of what EA is talking about with regard to self-publishing. One book out of over a thousand is hardly a ringing endorsement of the self-publishing industry.

I won't put words in EA's mouth (god forbid:) but for me, I warn only of self publishers disguised as commercial publishers, that work to convince new writers into thinking they are being published, rather then printed. My hat is off to a self publishing writer who enters into the task of properly printing, marketing their work. It's the scummy business's that exist to entrap a naive writer that I have any sort of problem with.
Publish America is the first that comes to mind but I know there are others.
The idea of promoting and selling exhausts and frightens me just thinking of it, so self publishing is obviously not for me.

"I feel bad for people who are taken in by vanity presses and who end up repaid for their money and effort only in frustration."

Aaamen! It seems like as much as people try to get the word out on what self-publishing actually entails, there are still going to be aspiring authors who are finding out for the first time.

I know someone who self-published in the true sense of getting an ISBN and having a cover designed and funding a print run and even got the book into the local warehouse stores--and the book did just okay, in spite of much promotion, because it was, er, unreadable. People would pick it up out of curiosity or social pressure, but most couldn't finish it or didn't enjoy it. I think so-called gatekeepers or even a really honest crit group could have saved the author much time and money.

I guess my point is that even the non-scam forms of self-publishing are still riskier than traditional publishing because any but the humblest of authors are likely to skip a really effective screening process.

---
And wow, to have read thousands of books by age 10 is voracious reading indeed. My voracious-reader kids probably read about 30-50 books a year (dependent on how well we at keeping their book supply stocked) and I thought that was a lot.

The middle schoolers I visited recently complained about the many, many typos they found in their trade books.

Yikes. I had to look up "My Beautiful Mommy." I didn't get to see the whole thing, but the preview pages on Amazon made me throw up in my mouth a little.

LOL.

I actually know the author of My Beautiful Mommy. As disgusting as it sounds, its really not so bad.

He didnt make it to hook kids on plastic surgery. He did it to help the kids whose mothers are undergoing procedures,so they would understand whats happening.Tells them what to expect in the language a child would understand. So they wont be scared when mommy comes home in bandages or looks different.

Still says something undesirable about our society, but I dont think the book is so bad when you know what its about.

No! Awesome use of the twilight zone. I'm going to steal that and exchange "publishing" for "writing".

Substitute "in a reasonable world" for "realistically" and the answer is yes. My agent sent a project out four months ago and not a peep.

In my ignorance of the process of manuscript submission, I also would have thought an agent would have had some response after 3 months. I don't know though if some of that time period was around the holidays?

A question, 9 sounds higher a number of Publishers to send to then I would have expected. Is it?

Get thee busy on a new project, eat lots of cupcakes and try not to dwell. That's usually kept the waiting demons at bay for me.

Channeling Rod Serling? Hmmm. Worth a shot, I guess. And unlike eating cupcakes doesn't require switching to elastic waist pants.

Thank you for that, the last paragraph made me laugh *very* hard :)

Ed Anon, thank you for making me laugh.
I needed it today.
Love your blog!

Genius - that was a coffee snorting moment. The waiting is indeed the equivalent of being trapped in a black hole having left your sanity behind out in space.

I often feel like I am caught in the "dimension of imagination." I can imagine many reasons why there is no response and none of them are really any good. I do like the advice of Nancy and can now imagine a wide variety of cupcakes to get lost in.

Okay, back to reality, those books aren't going to sell themselves.

Too long. When I was out on submission I heard back from everyone within two weeks.

Sometimes a longer wait is a good sign? - an indication perhaps that there is interest, the ms is having multiple reads and costs and projected incomes are being calculated??

12 weeks is time for a politely worded email to the publishers for an update.

Anonymous 2:08 -

"Too long" in what universe?

I can assure you that your experience, while certainly nice for you, is very far from normal.

You also don't indicate if your book ended up published.

In my experience, the only books that get responses from everyone as quickly as two weeks are either hugely commercial projects in which there is a ton of early interest, which leads people to read very quickly, and either a pre-empt or auction (or else everyone drops out...)

... OR they are the manuscripts that everyone can tell at a glance they don't want.

Either way, that is not the norm. Two weeks is not enough time for an editor to read the book, get a second read, take it to editorial board and take it to an acquisitions meeting, which is the process that most books have to go through at most publishers in order to happen.

- Agent Anonymous

It does seem odd that NOBODY has rejected it.

I'd say 12 weeks is time to nudge, for sure.

Have you spoken to your agent yet?

Can't speak for anyone else, but this author has just about had it with waiting on editors et al for months on end. Life is short, my ideas are abundant, my patience is wearing thin...

Now that so many interesting venues are popping up for ebooks and apps, a lot of us are exploring the alternatives. We're hiring freelance editors and designers to ensure a professional product, and testing the waters. Can't wait to ditch several layers of middlemen who currently receive a far larger cut than we do.

I love your final paragraph!

The worst part is the increasing feeling that there is no such thing as fiction and non-fiction, that it's all opinion and any suggestion to the contrary shows how closed minded you are.

It does seem like teachers and librarians are the best cheerleaders for non-fiction. Those of us selling books and other programs in the educational publishing industry know only too well the lack of funding. This goes for both fiction and non-fiction. However, there seems to be small pots of money for programs designed to increase reading comprehension and vocabulary. It is typically believed that non-fiction offers a higher interest level to those students who generally are less inclined to pick up a book.

That would be my pitch anyway if I had a non-fiction book to sell.

I sense some snarkery here that I feel the need to support with a stout "Huzzah!"

oh yes, who really cares about the future? Someone already threw a baseball through the ozone layer, and we'll all be dead by 2012, I think. That dude from the band said in in a song, or maybe it was another bit of his depressing poetry.

Thank you, public education!

Sounds like it's an agency to help the agents find authors?... what the! Wonder how he/she decides an author is qualified (the author's cheque has cleared?:)

Desperate people will pay for anything. Even something you can do for free. (Like querying.)

Ah, found her site and she has I guess lumped editors and agents together in a mass emailing.
Agents pay nothing.....

>I help you build your business at no cost to you so you can spend more time with higher quality authors that are prepared and want to work with you to get published.<

because on the authors page, they pay $1000!!!
This is no "eharmony" site... everyone pays to play there:)

While this does sound sickening rip off of naive writers there is a similarity here to illustrators portfolio sites. The artist posts samples for small and or large (over $1000)yearly fee's and editors/art directors/clients are free to look for talent as needed.
It works for illustrators, could it actually work for authors if it were set up for editors to be able to read first pages (or even just queries) on such a site?

EA, you shouldn't go with the first author-agent hookup service you find. It's a rapidly expanding field and not all of the agentagencies are legitimate. That's why I founded FindThePerfectAuthorAgentServiveForYou.com. You can register for free, answer a few questions, and then get instantly to a service that's perfect for you, whether you are an author looking for an agency to help you find an agent, an agent looking for an agency to help you meet new authors, or even a traditional author-agent agency looking for both authors and agents. All major credit cards are accepted.

All the agents I know have their information (what they are looking for, how to submit, etc) readily available on their websites. FOR FREE.

It saddens me that so many authors feel like there are shortcuts or loopholes, and are so eager to find them that they get taken advantage of.

christine tripp said...

"Wonder how he/she decides an author is qualified (the author's cheque has cleared?:)"

thanks for making me crack up!!

Warning! The Find the Perfect...commenter links to a phishing site.

'Servive'? If you can't spell your own URL...

Thanks for the alert about the phishing site! I've deleted the comment in question.

Are you sure that comment linked to a phishing site? I thought it was a pretty funny joke, and obviously created specifically for this occasion. (If you didn't read it, it was a fake advertisement for a service to help people choose an agency-searching service. In other words, taking the middleman absurdity one step further.)

As everyone knows, children's books are a snap to write. Publishing is merely a matter of knowing the right people. All Rowling needed for her contract were a few sentences scrawled on a napkin from her local coffee house. Services like the one EA discusses simply help put all of those great writers with pockets full of clever (albeit coffee-stained) ideas in contact with the publishers who will make them wealthy. Alternatively, many of these agencies can also help you get into the business of flipping real estate or assembling picture frames in the comfort of your own home for other ways to generate a six figure income.

No, it's not surprising. I'm French too and I know that many French publishers (especially small-middle sized) don't even try to sell rights to the UK and US markets because they know it requires agents, subagents and that it's extremely difficult because the English-speaking world is one of the most hermetic. Other countries are much more willing to buy and translate French books, so they focus on these ones.

Hermetic?
Many publishers simply send us copies of their books-- no agent required.

what I meant by hermetic is that the English-speaking market buys very few foreign books compared to most other markets. So some publishers focus on other countries - Italy, South East Asia, Eastern Europe especially I think - where they know they'll sell. UK/US publishers are infamously hard to sell to... so I wouldn't think that the French publisher of this person hasn't succeeded in selling her books to them. I'd just assume they haven't even tried! :)

I wrote this message. Thank you for the quick response.

In fact, I was talking about foreign rights, which are held by publishers. I think the majority of translations are decided at the books fair in Bologna.

The problem with the idea of "just" send a copy, is the dispersion: I can not ask all my editors to send a copy to every British publisher! Especially because I don't know anything about the market here.

So I can not search for an agent here if I do not have the foreign rights?

Alice, your French publisher might be ok with you working with an agent, but they may not. You should ask them, since you sold the rights to them.

Clementine, I take your point. Some US publishers seem to take more books from France than others, though. Searching for french authors on US Amazon may point people in the right direction.

If you are wondering how to narrow down which houses to have your French publisher send books to, you might look at houses that specialize in or have an imprint that specializes in foreign imports. In the US, Arthur A. Levine at Scholastic does (true, it is a small imprint--but it is one of their focuses), and I want to say Chicken House in the UK does as well. Whether you contact them through your publisher or through an agent, these kinds of publishers would probably be on the list.

Hehe, I know Alice's books very well. Bonne chance Alice :)

Thank you Anonymous (what a strange name) and Rose, I'll look for editor "specialized" in french book, and ask to my editors...

Moi aussi je te connais Clémentine, j'aime beaucoup le catalogue de Talents-hauts ;-) It's a small small world...

Are you referencing Shel Silverstein's 'The Giving Tree'? I thought that was a story about the self-sacrificing and unconditional love of a mother, who gives a good part of herself for the health and happiness of her child, from conception onwards really. That's how I read it when I picked up my nephew's copy - not so much life advice as holding up a mirror to motherhood.

Arthur Levine put out a great one a few years back called "How Are You Peeling" (and others by the same creators, Elffers and Freymann). I think it is a general audience book, even though it is marketed for kids. Probably would be harder to market for adults, though.

We have it and we all love it. Fun with fruits and vegetables!

Ah, EA, I would've guessed you were a fellow Giving Tree loather. IMHO, the people who dote on that book haven't read it very carefully.

The late Mr. Silverstein probably didn't think it worth mentioning that the tale had been slightly misinterpreted, while those royalty checks were rolling in.

I've seen people give The Giving Tree for many reasons and in many situations, and I'm afraid I always feel it's inappropriate.
Certainly there is some self-sacrifice in parenthood (what else is getting up at 3:00 am to clean up an infant with a stomach bug?). But utter sacrifice to another person-- sacrifice that leaves you ruined and destitute, dead?
Taking a bullet for your child is perfectly understandable, but letting them wipe their feet on you because their shoes are dirty is not.
I think one of the most important responsibilities of parenting (especially as the child grows older) is to role model a full and happy adult life, so that your child sees how it's done. Modeling an adulthood in which you destroy yourself for other people is sick. Is that what you want for your children?

Lol. As a child I thought that book was great and I couldn't see why my mother hated it so much.

Now, I see.

And I hate it too. And I find it somewhat annoying when other people love it.

But isn't there some irony in the fact that a tree actually did have to give it's life to make that book? And that that tree is totally unappreciated because of the book that was printed on it.

"If you love someone, let them chop you down to a stump."

That comment's a keeper!

A recent EA post reminds us "true generosity comes without obligation," in which case the Giving Tree is setting the best possible example for her boy. This giving without obligation is necessary anyway for the sake of continued life, but I'm not sure Silverstein's observations as recorded in the book don't agree with you too - especially in the world today, where infantilized adults keep on consuming without any regard or responsibility for the world or others. When I think of it I'm reminded as well by advice I once read elsewhere - don't forget your other half (and your own life), as your children will leave you. Still, the parents must set the example if the children are to learn from it and return a little care when the parents have nothing left to give.

As a former CCD student (and current CCD teacher), my loathing for the giving tree comes from all the adults over the years who tried to treat it as a religious parable. Inevitably, it all devolved into really, really bad theology of what "sacrificial love" actually means.

On the other hand, it does provide a GREAT example of a co-dependant relationship. Though I think John Forestor (folk singer) did a better job with the concept...

"You hold your breath, dear, and I'll turn blue, cause I'm so co-dependant with you! You unstable you, I'll enable you...."

I'd like to think the intended message of "The Giving Tree" is "Mammas Don't Let Your Babies Grow Up to Be A**holes," but maybe I'm just deluding myself.

Actually, being unappreciated by cruel and heartless children is a constant theme in Silverstein's work... I mean, think about the ABZ book-- constant references to poor, unappreciated Uncle Shelby. Of course, as we see from "A Boy Named Sue," he also felt that the legacy parents bequeath to their children is one of pain and suffering.

Clearly, he was writing as a form of therapy.

What I find odd about people's love for Giving Tree is that, given the rest of Silverstein's work, it's pretty clear that he's usually writing tongue in cheek. Yet people take the giving tree as some deep, earnest story about how much they love their kids....

Really, I think the tree is like LC.S. Lewis's description of those mothers who simply live for everyone else around them--- and you can tell, because of the hunted, miserable looks on everyone else.

Or, as the old saying goes: "A Saint is someone who has to live with a Martyr."

this is a great send up of the giving tree for people who loathe it:

sassy gay friend: the giving tree

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XYQavD9mSIc

Haha! The first thing that went through my mind when I reached the "nether regions" of that post was "Aww! The Giving Tree!" Then, I promptly read your interpretation, and couldn't help but also think, "Fair enough." I think my favorite thing about my copy of The Giving Tree is the calligraphy writing of the family friend who gave it to me inside the front cover.

... and that concludes today's segment of "childhood memories from random strangers."

This is not related to the post, but I thought it is relevant to share...
A comic strip from Posy Simmonds on the preconceived ideas about the world of Children's Picture Books...
http://blog.drawn.ca/post/3445342771/a-too-true-view-of-childrens-publishing-by-the

I recently ran across a picture book, It's a Book by Lane Smith and although there are some children who may enjoy it, there was definitely an adultness to it. I don't mind that really although I can't imagine it being an easy sell and if it weren't such a popular children's book writer and illustrator, I do wonder if it would have been published.

I loved the final sentence, "True generosity comes without obligation."

I'm the email writer. Thank you so much for your answer.

I've decided not to send him a copy out of the blue. Even if I don't ask him what he thought of it, there's always a kind of pressure in the giving, isn't there? I don't even want that.

I will of course offer to gift him one if my writing career comes up in conversation and he mentions he'd like to read the book, but that's just polite.

Thank you again for reading my email. I'm grateful for the advice.

"be a good gift-giver and never ask him if he got around to reading it."

This struck me as hilarious. I NEVER ask people if they've read my book, and I can't imagine why any author ever would. What if they hated it? I figure if they've read it and liked it, they'll volunteer the information.

I have a relative who's had several books hit the NYT Bestseller list. For many years I was uncomfortable approaching her or even telling her I wrote. When I finally swallowed my pride recently and asked her for a cover blurb, she not only provided one -- something she hasn't agreed to do for anyone in years -- but offered to refer me to her big-name agent when my next manuscript is ready. She's not doing this out of a sense of obligation but because she really believes in my talent.

The moral: Don't discount any of your contacts. Selling is a relationship game. Don't be obnoxious but also don't be (like I was) a shrinking violet. THIS book for you is a done deal; next book, though, consult him -- and trust in your talent to wow him.

I have a step-mom who's prodigious at giving gifts with expectations. A couple of weeks ago she gave me a 2011 art calendar and said, "You'll have to find a place to hang this up." I already had a calendar, and the new one's still sitting on a pile on my desk. And once on Christmas, while other gifts were being exchanged and opened, she gave my kids and their cousins puppets, then told them to gather around (right that moment) and put on a puppet show for her. My then-six-year-old gave all the rest of the adults secret delight when he announced, "I'm outta here."

Even just as the author of a blog, I do relate to the poster's question, because while on the one hand I want everyone in the world to read my blog and lavish praise it, I also often refrain from even telling acquaintances that I have a blog, so they won't think I expect them to read it. (But I do link to it from Facebook, since those who see it there will already be online and can click or not click according to their mood.)

To the author who asked the question, good luck with your career. I think you made a good decision. When your next book ends up on the bestseller lists, you can drop your editor-friend a note and share the good news. :)

Personally,
I haven't had much success with critique groups (and I've found that my literary reader friends are better resources than my writer friends), but my developmental editor has made me ten times the writer I could have been otherwise. He's Richard Marek and I can;t recommend him highly enough.

Layton Green
www.laytongreen.com

I'm currently part of the Nevada SCBWI's Mentor Program. I have a wonderful mentor who currently works as a freelance editor. However, I'm glad I had years with my critique group before working with my mentor. Here's why:

First, my critique group taught me how to take criticism. I can now handle criticism, and I also know how I handle it. I was able to tell my mentor that I need time to consider a critique before responding to it, but that I'll want to talk about it later. I would hate to just now be figuring that out.

Second, my terrific critique group knocked off so many rough edges. You don't want to pay an editor to tell you not to use passive verbs or that your characterization needs work. If you've already worked with a (good!) group your time with the editor will count for something more than training in more basic skills.

Keep an eye out for good classes and programs or writing conferences. That's another good way to hone your skills.

And I have to put a plug in for Nevada. Check out their Mentor Program!

I recommend Brown Dog Editorial Services-- it's run by a real editor with real-world experience in children's books and it doesn't cost as much as some services.

http://browndogedits.com/

An excellent critique group is wonderful but often hard to find, and bad/off the mark advice can be worse than no advice at all. Maybe you should consider a good manuscript oriented class for YA or children's writers. There are wonderful classes, both live and online, taught by YA writers and editors at www.writers.com, Gotham Writers Workshop, MediaBistro, The Writers Center, and others. Writers submit pages every week (some even focus on whole novels) and get feedback from a pro as well as classmates. A good teacher can point out more than problems with your work. She can suggest writing techniques to help you move forward.

Never used her, but I hear C.A. Marshall is supposed to be awesome. I follow her blog and twitter, and she's good. Also an intern at an agency, so she knows her stuff.

http://www.camarshall.com/

That being said, a good critique group works, but can be a long process. You can also find beta readers, which may be what you want at this point. Beta readers borrow their name from beta testers, which test a computer program or website before it's sent out. They look for bugs in the completed system and identify errors. Beta readers do the same for manuscripts, reading things over the entire thing, pointing out parts that work and don't. These people usually aren't in a long-term commitment with you, but agree to read your whole MS (at least) once. They do it for free, but usually that comes with the understanding that if they need beta readers and ask you to help, you'll return the favor. If you have a blog, a simple call for beta readers will usually lend good results. Otherwise, find an online community or some twitter friends and ask around. The key is not to be shy.

I'm a freelance editor. You can see my profile on Elance.com as Jandersen22.

I'm a freelance editor. You can see my profile on Elance.com as jandersen22

Suggestion for question #3: join the Romance Writers of America. They're fabulous at educating members about the publishing industry, and you'll be able to find a critique group or recs for freelance editors very easily.

The best workshop I attended at last summer's SCBWI LA conference was taught by Chris Eboch--http://chriseboch.blogspot.com/

She does freelance editing, with details on her blog.

Anon, thanks for the view into the industry from your POV!

I dunno EA--do you think vampire books will be hot forever? (Bite me now if so.)

*ahem* Would it be inappropriate to toot my own horn and mention that I offer freelance editing at the reasonable price of the newly-graduated and unemployed?

Though the suggestion about finding a good critique group is a good one. My critique group's done wonders for me. The only downside is that critique groups take a lot of time, novel-wise - first you have to find one that's a good fit for you (since sometimes they can be...not very good) and then there's the matter of how much each group takes on each week.

My group reads our submissions during out meetings, so we usually only have time for about 6 pages at a shot. It's great for focusing on individual scenes, but it takes a long time before anyone can give feedback on the WIP as a whole.

Here's what this independent editor thinks:
As awesome as critique groups are (I always tell people to join one), they are a far cry from professional editing, if that's what you're looking for. Other writers' feedback can and should be a very major part of your development as a writer, and that support is available at every stage, for every piece you take to your group, for free! But good freelance editors provide editorial feedback from the perspective of a publishing insider, which tends to be very, very different from what you'll hear from your writing circle.

Sadly, I can't tell you where to find a qualified freelancer, other than by referral. People talk about the EFA as a good resource, but they don't actually screen their members for training and experience. Anyone can pay the fee and wear the badge.

Anyway, find an editor with verifiable experience in book publishing, not an English BA/MFA/whatever who "loves books." Even published authors don't necessarily have editorial skill. Sorry for the scorn, I just hate seeing writers get ripped off. It happens too much.

One of my former editors is now a freelancer, and I miss her:

http://www.tamsonweston.com/

I can recommend these editors:
http://www.editingforauthors.com/index.html

http://lauraannegilman.net/dymk_new.shtm

As a freelance editor AND a huge critiquer, I think that a strong critique group can give you what an editor does, but...people have lots of reasons for NOT wanting to join them. There isn't a critique group nearby that works; someone's not comfortable with online groups; they don't have the time/inclination to critique other people's work (although I think they lose out on a LOT of writing-craft education with that choice); it takes too long to get the whole group up and running.

I recommend to everybody that they get into a critique group, that they take the time & energy to build a strong one. Meanwhile, though, if they're looking for an edit NOW, then finding a good freelance editor can be the solution they need.

I became unemployed before I finished my ms. Now I can't afford to hire an editor, and I'm not sure if I can polish that ms good enough on my own. So... If you find the answer to your question without dishing out $1,856.15, please let me know.

Kara LaReau of Bluebird Works is a genius, formerly of Candlewick & Scholastic.

Also I second Tamson Weston.

And Emma Dryden.

I am an aspiring children's book author who has some unpublished children's stories. I sometimes post my work at [email protected]
This summer, I plan to take a creative writing class.

Try Book Editing Associates:

http://www.book-editing.com/

Great reputation and all editors are thoroughly vetted, extensively tested, and must have published (not self-published) projects to their name. (I know the testing is extensive and hard core because I belong to the Network.)

Make sure always to check Preditors and Editors and do thorough Google before you work with any editor.

I'm not a huge fan of critique groups- too time consuming and you don't always click with everyone in the group.

I've found my best readers through conferences and workshops. Find people whose work you admire, offer to trade manuscripts. That's worked great for me.

I've tried multiple critique groups and never found a good match--- But I've found some good one on one critique partners.

One problem with groups is that chemistry matters. So if there are a couple members of the group who make you crazy with their blatent disregard for spell-checking and the elements of style, the whole group starts to feel like a prison, rather than a help.

Perhaps you can try a few manuscript swaps? You get more focused attention, and it's hard to get a good critique one chapter at a time-- an all-at-once critique is more helpful.

I have found that, as I write/edit more, I get better at self -critiquing. In fact, I leave nasty notes to myself as I type...

Hi. I hope you don’t mind me commenting on this last question: “I have written a novel (fiction/semi-romantic). I would like to find someone professional who would read it and tell me how to proceed from this point. If you have any specific advice it would be greatly appreciated.” I have made a small living out of being a creative writing tutor, and I have acted as an development/editorial coach in the past. And, at risk of undoing any future work as a development/editorial coach, I completely agree with Editorial Anonymous. Creative writing groups and classes can often be better than an editorial coach/development editor. In a group or class, you can get feed back from various individuals – people who may be your target market. Also, if you’re looking for information on how to publish, the industry, trends etc, there’s no better place than the internet. There are hundreds of blogs, trade publications, and articles on the internet, and going to an editing coach for this sort of information may be unnecessary. Finally, I often find those who hire editing professionals aren’t always looking for critical feedback, but are actually fishing for complements. They want to hear that their manuscript is perfect and ready for publication. Someone had mentioned in the above comments that a group can be a long process – well, so can editing a manuscript to make it publication ready. No matter what, the time will need to be put into the product. So, I’d suggest taking a class or joining a group first, and to be open about any feedback that you may receive.

Meh. Don't worry until your story starts arguing back at you from the page - and winning.

When you can't win an argument with a talking dog you created, then you can question your sanity. (Or just bribe it with a sprinkle covered doggie biscuit. It works more often than I care to admit.)

I've had moments where the writing took over, but then again, I think there's some merit to developing the skill of being able to shape a story into a format. So if you want it to be a picture book, find the places to cut in order to make it what you want it to be. If you think it should be a chapter book, craft it that way. Write it both ways, and see what works best for the story you want to tell.

Perfect closing remark, Ed Anon. Made me laugh. Maybe, along with pencils and coffee mugs, SCBWI should pass out logoed straight jackets at conferences.

Of course the work takes over! If we wrote just what we planned it would be incredibly boring.

I always lose arguments with my characters. Because, when they take the time to put up that big a fight, they're usually right... and it's easier just to go along with them then to force them to be someone they're not....

I am convinced that most if not all writers are mildly crazy. And they all embrace the crazies like an alcoholic clings to his beer.

The craziness is part of our charm (Minnesota SCBWI Illustrator Coordinator here).

I always envisioned my idea as a picture book. I knew exactly what it would look like. After many rejections, I thought maybe I should submit it as a short story collection. Still rejected. Finally I got some good advice from an editor at a SCBWI local summer picnic. She told me to submit it to educational publishers. I did, and it's coming out with Scholastic this summer.

Moral to the story: be flexible!

I had a (teacher) friend who had once started a three-page writing exercise . . . by the time she had finished, the work had blossomed into a 36-chapter middle-grade novel. These things happen.

Brian Selznick's The Invention of Hugo Cabret straddles the line between graphic novel and MG novel. It's worth reading.

EA's advice sounds like a good idea. I'll add this from my own experience: don't panic! There's no need.

It sounds like you're growing creatively - that involves a lot of unknowns, which can feel overwhelming. But don't forget that this is your first attempt at writing a story. If you're anything like most writers, you'll produce a lot of unusable stuff before you get to something that works. Have patience with yourself - you can enjoy the play of words and thoughts, even when they don't lead to something you want to share with the world.

By all means, educate your inner critic on the writer's craft, but don't let him/her then squelch you with worry. Best of luck!

Uri Shulevitz's book "Writing with Pictures" might be a great resource for you. Good luck.

Thanks EA! I really was under the impression that Authors were at all times in control of their story. I love that I'm not the only crazy and in such great LOONIE company!
I'll definitely take everyone's advice. Whether this idea/manuscript/GN straightens itself out or ends up at the bottom of a drawer, it continues to be completely frustrating, great fun and a learning experience.

Re: poetry. I've found In the Palm of Your Hand by Steve Kowit to be really helpful. I think learning how to do "real" poetry can help you do it well in a picture book. Which is to say, I see no reason "poetry in picture books" should be different from poetry in general, except perhaps in content.

"Under the influence of cold medicine, I cranked out what I think is a cute picture book (text only, no art, but I'm still taking cold medicine so watch out). I am not new to writing, but am new to writing for kids. Specifically, I would like to learn more about rhyme, verse and poetry in picture books."

Read "A Poke in the Eye"
"A Kick in the Head"
"A Foot in the Mouth"

all published by Candlewick.

Rashka's art adds some much to the experience making it great picture book poetry.

Just remember that your core reader is a tired, stressed-out parent who knows nothing about rhyme and metre and who would rather be drinking gin and tonic in the bath than reading a bedtime story.

I'm not sure how basic you want your rhyming PB links to be, but I like these two:

http://www.dorichaconas.com/Icing%20the%20Cake%20page.htm

and

http://www.lorislesynski.com/writing.html

As one who's sold pbs in rhyme, I'd beg to disagree with Adam. Poetry in picture books IS different. Here's my favorite essay on writing rhyme for kids:

http://www.dorichaconas.com/Icing%20the%20Cake%20page.htm

And, btw, unless you're Samuel Coleridge, you probably shouldn't be trying to write while drugged. It's hard enough when you've got all your faculties.

Enjoyed the post AND the comments!

"Read "A Poke in the Eye"
"A Kick in the Head"
"A Foot in the Mouth"

all published by Candlewick.

Rashka's art adds some much to the experience making it great picture book poetry."

I am terribly sorry. I meant " A Poke in the I."

Rashka's art adds so much to the experience... and still stet...."


Does sleep deprivation count as drug use?




Read those books!! :)

Re: Anon 12:21. The information in the link you provided doesn't appear to contradict what I said. It looks like a great beginner's primer to rhyme and rhythm.

Reading books like the one I suggested just takes that knowledge farther, adds to it, and improves it with practice.

AE, I just ordered A Foot in the Mouth (not that I needed another one). Thanks for the recommendation!

AE, I just ordered A Foot in the Mouth (not that I needed another one). Thanks for the recommendation!

"Writing Picture Books: A Hands-On Guide From Story Creation to Publication" by Ann Whitford Paul, is a fantastic resource. It will give you the tools you need to understand how to tell your story in verse, and do it well.

Brave Potatoes is my favorite children's story book using poetry. I was introduced to it when Daniel Shore (sp?) read it on NPR, but I've since given it to a dozen new parents and memorized it by rereading it to my own kids.

Rhyme (but not regular), overt verbal wit, coy allusive humor, and unexpected heroic action from a band of potatoes! What more could one ask for?

By all means read Dori Chaconas's article, cited twice above.

If you wrote stories for a newspaper that employed you, that was almost surely work for hire (WFH). You don't own it anymore. If you were a freelancer, it depends on what rights you sold. I think you need to dig a little deeper and find out under what circumstances, if any, you could get back the rights to use the work in another form. For example, a writer who sells all rights to an article to a magazine can often get book rights back if she wants to use the article as a chapter in a book, if there's already a book publisher in the picture.

Eilonwy, I daresay you mean Daniel Pinkwater. You can listen to the recording of Daniel & Scott Simon reading BRAVE POTATOES here:

http://www.npr.org/templates/story/story.php?storyId=1079549

Carin, I am so glad you love these.... aren't they the best!!!

(I am also a typography fanatic so I absorb that aspect...)

And Carin, I am a big Rashka fan, and I love poetry! Am working on an illustrated fractured rhyme book now (not that it is poetry per se, but... I got three art final samples done with verses and am finally happy) And I don't do much of this kind of gig but this one really got me and I am running with it... over... the... years... .

Orig Poster: Research the kids poetry market and make your work different but kid friendly!

:)

Re: newspaper articles - As I understand it, you can use the research you did to write other articles for other publications, but you can't reuse your prose (unless your contract allows for reprints). For example, you might use the same source material to write an article for a newspaper and for a hobby magazine. The way you approach the material would be very different, but you'd get double the mileage out of your research.

I'm still such a believer in judging your own work and learning more from the masters. For me, the master of young poems is Shel Silverstein and, again for me, his best was "Where the Sidewalk Ends".
When I hold up anything I could do against the likes of that man, it pales.
He was also a master of cartoon illustration that all on it's own could make you laugh. I think his visual art was under appreciated.

"I'm still such a believer in judging your own work and learning more from the masters. For me, the master of young poems is Shel Silverstein and, again for me, his best was "Where the Sidewalk Ends"."

They put that that to theater for kids. Wild!

AE - Great good luck on your project!

Literaticat! What a fine correction of my error. Now I know where to find that recording of Brave Potatoes again. Thanks so much!

>Writing children's books is like singing-- something EVERYONE, even the ones who don't know how to cook, think they can do acceptably.  I swear to god, if you started stopping people on the street and asking them if they had an idea for a children's book, 99% of them would say yes.<

So true and American Idol brings that point crashing home:)

>  This is why editors don't generally admit to what they do when speaking to strangers.<

Also why working Illustrators cringe just a little when saying what they do for a living, at a party or in a group. We are preparing/shielding ourselves for that hammer to come down, which it always does. At some point in the evening, after that revelation, at least one person will corner you and tell you all about how they have written a children's book and maybe, if your very lucky, they will let you illustrate it!!!! Oh bother:(

Oh I really love this post!

A hack artist? Really?... Well everyone is entitled to their fears I guess. Mine are scorpions and running out of chocolate.

You couldn't be more right about the group division in the children's book world. And the ones that are left out who don't belong to any category think writing children's books is super duper easy and say anyone can do it. I can't tell you how many times I've heard that one before!

"Also, isn't writing children's books like opening a restaurant--something that everyone wants to do but almost nobody really succeeds at?

No, no. It's worse than that."

This made me laugh so hard I spit tea. I started writing when I was young and stupid. Now that I'm well aware of hard it is, I think I'd have my present self tell my past self to seriously consider opening a restaurant.

Thank you, so much EA! I'm going to send the link to this post to about a dozen people I know.

I don't have an idea for a children's book. I WANT an idea. I think I might have an easier time convincing Little Girl that reading is fun if I wrote something I'd allow her to read. But I don't have an idea.

Also, starting a restaurant takes a significant outlay of money -- pots/pans, tables/chairs, a building, inspections, stuff. People with a dream recognize this and unless they're really driven, they let the risk convince them to put it on a back burner.

Writing requires a notebook and a pencil. (I know, writing well takes a lot more than that, but simply writing only requires those two relatively inexpensive things.) Until you get to the submission stage, it's very low risk.

"I am a working writer (film) and director.
I have written a children's book"

This is my favorite part. Dude, you have a job already. Stop crawling into mine. And editors, get the $$ bills out of your eyes when you choose these types of folks who you think are going to get your book into film. Are you stoned?

I'm so glad you're back. I really missed your posts for the months you were away. I kept waitng for you to reappear in my "Blogger reading list." Today, I'm finally commenting...

Thanks for the straight shootin' as always.

http://michellecusolito.blogspot.com/

>And editors, get the $$ bills out of your eyes when you choose these types of folks who you think are going to get your book into film. Are you stoned?<

Anon, no Editor is going to this a film writer/director will have the pull to get their book made into a film. Unless of course the letter was written by Martin Scorcese (sp?) or someone along those lines (and it where, he wouldn't be worried about the Editor finding a "hack" illustrator for his book, he could BUY a celeb Illustrator:)
There are a LOT of unknown working people in the film industry that have NO influence what so ever.

I'm a long time lurker just starting to get out on the blog-sphere and I wanted to say thank you for taking the time to give us these clear concise answers and advice. This website has been extremely helpful.

As the person who inquired, I have to say thank you for this helpful answer. I've tried to educate myself, but every business has its political minefields. I'm happy to be assured I did not step into one.

im not sure what u mean, waiting always sux

~ <3 Famous Poetry about life <3~

i like where you went with this


- <3 Famous

Poetry about life

>C. A chapter book is a short novel for short people.  Treat it like that.<

Yes. I would assume so because no matter how many illustrations the author thinks will be included in the book, the usual is only one (perhaps 2) per chapter. That's not really a LOT of pictures. The illustration for chapters does not make up 50% of the book so I would think submission would be the same as with anything other then a PB. Most picture book submissions ask for the complete text but that's because a PB text can fit on often one page.

I would love to read a book that a novel. It is interesting to read both but the book is my favorite. A novel is such short, while a book will give you the detailed story. I am happy to have read this. Thanks for the awesome post!

It's called a Public Lending Right program. We have one in the UK: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Public_Lending_Right

EA-- It's a Canadian thing... they get paid for library books like Hollywood people get paid for movie checkouts.

Which sounds heavenly, until you start thinking about the ramifications for libraries. Then it gets a lot more complicated.

(Of course, if your book has a lot of checkouts/holds at a US library, they respond by buying more copies!)

In Canada, Britain, and at least part of Europe, libraries do pay library royalties.

That's true for the U.K. the Public Lending Right, I think it's called.

In the UK, and many other European countries, we have Public Lending Right. This compensates authors for the potential loss in sales that library loans may cause. This year the rate stands at about 6 pence per loan.

British authors are very grateful for their feb. PLR payout!

http://www.plr.uk.com/

There's nothing ridiculous about royalties on library check-outs. It's standard in many territories, such as the UK, Australia and Germany and government funded. It's a shame U.S. publishers don't lobby for it here.

The library payments are made in Canada.

Carol Shields once told me that Canadian authors did indeed get royalties based on checkouts at libraries. I think they take a sample of libraries and extrapolate from there. We agreed this was quite civilized. I'm pretty sure it's the Canadian government that pays.

April Henry (aprilhenrymysteries.com)

The thing with the library checkouts happens in (I think) Canada, the UK, and Australia. The amounts involved are usually very small, and we don't have it at all in the US.

someone told me that authors get some sort of credit that translates into a payout when readers check out their books from the library.

This is not totally wrong. It happens in Canada, actually, along with many other countries; it's called Public Lending Right, and allows authors to receive a modest reimbursement each year for the use of their books in libraries (and the associated loss of potential sales that may result from that).

Nobody's going to get rich off PLR, but every little bit helps.

"This may be true for digital books; I'm not very familiar with how that works at libraries. But regular books? That's RIDICULOUS. Libraries buy books the same way everybody else does: they pay for THAT COPY and that copy only."

Just for the sake for anyone else who wants to search for information, the principle by which libraries can lend out their copies of books is known as "law of first sale" or "first sale doctrine."

Some libraries have experimented with lending out e-readers pre-loaded with books. I think that doing so would work much like lending a paper book. But for lending e-books via download, most libraries use a service called Overdrive. I don't know much about how it works (I'm a librarian, but so far we don't have e-books), but I have heard that libraries usually pay more than direct consumers for the e-books (something like full hardcover price). Whether any more of that price would go to the author, I have no idea. For all I know, the extra money just goes to Overdrive, which is a distributor. From what I've been able to glean, adjustments to the library's lending scale (i.e. the size of its user group) are achieved by the library's purchasing multiple licenses for an e-book if it wants to lend more than one copy at once, much as a library would do for a popular print book.

"ut regular books? That's RIDICULOUS. Libraries buy books the same way everybody else does: they pay for THAT COPY and that copy only."

In the UK (and possibly other countries), there is a payment to authors each time their book is borrowed(*), up to a maximum per year.

(*Although only a selection of libraries are monitored and the numbers multiplied up to get an estimate.)

Some countries, including Canada, have a Public Lending Right which is defined as "the right of authors to receive payment for free public use of their works in libraries." Maybe this is what the previous poster was asking about?

Actually, there's something called the Public Lending Rights program, used in the UK and in a number of other countries, by which authors do get paid when their books are checked out of libraries.

I just learned about this recently myself, and was astonished. I have no idea how much authors stand to make by it, though.

[url]http://www.plrinternational.com/established/established.htm[/url]

The idea of library users not generating author income aside from the original purchase is an old theme among authors.

When Huckleberry Finn was banned from some libraries in Massachusetts after its publication (in those days it was the 'low moral tone' and not the n-word that got the book into trouble), Twain wrote in a letter:

This generous action of theirs must necessarily benefit me in one or two additional ways. For instance, it will deter other libraries from buying the book; and you are doubtless aware that one book in a public library prevents the sale of a sure ten and a possible hundred of its mates."

He also thought the controversy helped sales, which in that case, at least, was probably true.

Hey EA -- may I make two follow-up comments from a fellow editor?

First, if you're selling a book with a blurb, be sure that the big-name author is agreeing that the blurb can be used on the cover/in promotion of the book. It's frustrating and deceptive-feeling for all involved to be told, long after the book is bought, that the blurb was only for the purposes of getting the author a contract, not for helping to promote that book to readers and book buyers.

Secondly, that government payment for library circulation actually isn't a myth! It's called the Public Lending Right Commission. But sadly, it only happens in the UK and overseas, not here in the US. More data here: http://www.plrinternational.com/faqs/faqs.htm#plr

The other day, someone told me that authors get some sort of credit that translates into a payout when readers check out their books from the library.

They do indeed. My dad wrote a minor non-fiction book that was published many years ago here in the UK. Not many people borrow it from the library, so once a year he gets a cheque for about 30p. XP

Cheryl

Actually, in Canada, authors and illustrators do get paid a small amount for their books being used in the library. It's called Public Lending Right and is funded by a separate government grant. Authors and illustrators register to be part of it. Seven different libraries across the country are surveyed each year. The author gets a payment for each library their books appears in. (The assumption is that the library would not keep it around if it wasn't circulating.) There is a maximum amount per author. It's really nice to get that PLR cheque once a year, particularly when royalty statements can be somewhat depressing these days.

With regard to authors getting paid by libraries - it is a real program in some countries like Canada (for Canadian authors only).

See how the program works here: http://www.plr-dpp.ca/PLR/program/PLR_program.aspx

I think in the UK the library royalties thing might apply, or at least might HAVE. I remember Neil Gaiman posting something about the government voting to END something like that awhile back, and him being scandalized. I think.

Thanks for the run-down and your always straight-from-the-hip answers, EA! Even those of us not shopping children's and YA mss right now learn much here.

I don't know about 'RIDICULOUS'. Public Lending Right, as it's called, is a vital supplement to the income of a lot of authors in countries like the UK (of course, the UK government is thought to be planning to get rid of it, in tandem with their programme to make libraries better by shutting them down, but that's a whole other story). I might buy a copy of a book and lend it to my friend, but a library will potentially lend their copy to hundreds of people. There is a clear argument for making a distinction.

However, PLR is only affordable in relatively high-tax, high state-spending societies, so I don't see the US going in for it.

EA, I don't know how it works in the US, but in Australia we have a government scheme called Public Lending Rights, which is a cultural program that makes payments to eligible Australian creators and publishers in recognition that income is lost through the free multiple use of their books in public and educational lending libraries.

Authors in countries who participate in a Public Lending Right program are compensated when someone borrows a book from a library in that country. See http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Public_Lending_Right.

Fascinating! the things I never knew about the library systems in the british commonwealth!

We have the Public lending right in NZ although it doesn't extend to school libraries which is especially sad if you are a children's author. But i get a nice cheque just before christmas which comes in very handy.

And Canada EA (everyone always forgets about us:)
The "Access Copyright" division is kind of fascinating. It charges a license fee (now, I believe this is how it works, correct me anyone if it's wrong) to institutions and business's that provide the public access to a copying machine. For instance, a few years back a Popular name stationary store was charged with not paying the fee while operating a copy machine.
The assumption is pages from books will be copied and used for presentations etc. There is "Fair Use" for schools etc but not sure how that is factored in to
"Access Copyrights" license. Perhaps schools and libraries pay less or are even exempt?
Pepper, it's not that small an amount of money collected by both organizations. Just the Public Lending Rights alone reported to have taken in and dispersed to 17,000 Canadian Authors/Illustrators, over $9.9 million for 2010:)
Hey, all the Countries mentioned in this discussion also have Universal Health Care too..... and though our Libraries and Schools are well funded, between all of this "Free" stuff, Americans would likely faint to see the taxes we pay to get all this, nothings free right:) So, it's nice to get some of your own taxes back via your own books:)

Can I defend my profession for just a sec? Don't discount libraries in helping your sales. Study after study has shown that big-time library users are also big-time book buyers. A number of my students and their parents will rush out and buy a book (or the next in the series) after I showed it to them in the library. Librarians also create many of the book awards and lists that contribute to book sales (the Newbery being the most famous example).

I'm all for people getting paid for what they create, but please, oh, please don't take it out of my meager budget! I'm just trying to get as many books as I can for my kids in a world where "buying books" is somewhat of an antiquated notion to administrators and I am fighting for my very existence!!

Rant over. Thanks.

We have public lending rights here in New Zealand as well. Trouble is, the money comes from a fixed pool so the more authors who publish and the more books there are published, the more the rate per book goes down. We get paid just before Christmas. It's very handy

In Australia at least the Public Lending Right came into being after long agitation by authors. These things don't happen without organised action, and organised action doesn't happen until someone decides the right thing isn't ridiculous (a bit like free health care).